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59
  ·  17 days ago

Yeah... those last minute votes are a shame... but honestly, what gets on my nerves much more is those early paid votes that clog up the hot and trending pages with shitposts.

imho it would be more important to prevent paid votes before the posts are a day or maybe 2 old. I get that this initiative targets improved correctability (if that's a word) of post rewards but I think re-enabling organic discovery through "normally" curated trending/hot sections would be of greater effect!

just my two cents!

#kittensunite

edit: oh and blacklists... why can't we just get all those meme-re-posters blacklisted in the big voting bots... damn, i forgot again, they all just care for the ka-ching and couldn't give less shit about the health of this ecosystem...

#rantover

editagain: and just to be clear, yes I do use voting bots, it would be silly to let the shameless walk away with all of it by themselves... but I do play it fair and vote my stuff at 3-5 days - my "real" supporters get their curation and you get your chance to correct me if neccessary...

#overandout

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41
  ·  17 days ago

can someone please explain what this is all about? a newbie question obviously, but seems like some folks are doing some kind of unethical voting?

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59
  ·  17 days ago

It is possible to pay for receiving upvotes. Recently there's been an explosion of these paid voting services and it is skewing the game (reward distribution and content ranking) on steem quite significantly...

There's a big debate about this lately and the community is struggling to find a productive consensus about it... welcome to steem politics. This is a full fledged economy here with all it's bright and dark sides.

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39
  ·  17 days ago

My bigger problem is the amount of spam on the platform. Just read a few comments down and you will see what i have in mind. "Woah great comment" being spammed over and over.

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41
  ·  17 days ago

fight spam comments is easy - we need just attach 0.01 steem fee on comments.

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25
  ·  17 days ago

i think that won't solve the problem.

In your case if bots are paid to post and like comments so they will get paid more to cover posting fees...

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25
  ·  17 days ago

Im new to steem but the way i understood it was that its the goal of steem to be completely free and without any fees for the currency?

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25
  ·  17 days ago

that would discourage people from commenting. Perhaps some clever filtering on comments that get no upvotes. Suppressing them...not sure

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50
  ·  16 days ago

It's an interesting idea to explore. Maybe each post should take away some "posting power" like each vote eats at our voting power.

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35
  ·  16 days ago

Or perhaps ‘voter confidence by peers’ add a Downvote so if everyone downvotes your post you lose money for those & if you get a very high number to if downvotes you get banned. Something for accountability. Otherwise there will be monopolized ‘gang’ up voters just for da 💰

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25
  ·  15 days ago

I agree with the downvotes!

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47
  ·  16 days ago

Yeah "love your post..;P keep it up see what I have too!!.!"

If Steemit needs anything it's more consumers and commenters. More people bringing interesting discussion. Look at how people use reddit, they don't just scroll down the front page and click article links, they read through the comments to see what people think. Reward pool or no, the discussion is what makes people feel like there is a real community, and comment spam ruins that.

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38
  ·  10 days ago

This is an excellent point. At this stage the people on Steemit are largely creators. They don't mind having a read of someone elses work but there is always the underpinning goal of getting them to head over to their own blog and upvote.

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59
  ·  17 days ago

I agree that spam is a serious issue of it's own... but as long as the spam doesn't get the majority of the reward pool it won't have damaging economic effects... it's when spam meets paid upvotes where we really enter difficult territory!

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49
  ·  17 days ago

Instead it lowers interest in the site, people leave, steem goes down becomes worthless.

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37
  ·  16 days ago

Yeah, the spam comments definitely do still have their own downside. Turning people away from the platform because all they see is bots and spam. However, it doesn't have the direct economic affects that these vote bots do.

The long term affect of the spam may be a bigger problem, but I think that attracting newer users isn't the biggest problem right now... It's keeping the current users. The ones being affected by these bots.

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49
  ·  15 days ago

It's current users I'm talking about... I know more than a few who are fed up with the constant spam and are powering down. They aren't getting votes anyway, since everyone either upvotes themselves or uses their vote to pander to whales in the hopes they'll notice them and upvote their post one day. Actual users outside the whale pool are mostly ignored.

(Including a published writer who was using Steemit as prelaunches for his books/stories/etc... a sad thing for us to lose as "content" goes.)

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34
  ·  16 days ago

great comment

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54
  ·  16 days ago

Woah great comment!

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25
  ·  16 days ago

So is it appropriate to label these comments as spam? Many reddit communities avoid low quality comments this way.

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41
  ·  15 days ago

yes, 100% agree,
If you have nothing to say: say "Nothing"

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49
  ·  16 days ago

As a minnow in the current system, even if you make great content that does generate a lot of natural upvotes once it gets noticed, you will very frequently find your posts getting little to no traction if you don't buy an early upvote. The ability to buy upvotes actually transfers power from whales to minnows, without it, whales have 100% complete control over what content gets seen.

I wanted to test steem out from a minnow perspective so I made a new account and slowly have built up a reasonable amount of follows / steemit (still small bet steady progress) and I literally was getting nowhere until I started reinvesting my post rewards into early vote buys to get my posts noticed. Often after that initial investment they would go on to make $20+ but without the initial bump the exact same content would make 2 or 3 cents.

I don't think its a bad thing to give people who are confident that their content is good a way to pay for it to get noticed and the ability to reap the rewards if there investment in an early upvote does in fact pay off. This is actually a very simple and effective method of early curation that removes power from the whales. Without randowhale/booster/steemlike/etc my guess is I would have gotten nowhere.

Early on, I thought that vote buying was a huge problem with steemit, but I've come to believe that in reality, without it, a small number of whales would dominate the front page even more than they already do and keep most or all of the platform rewards for themselves.

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46
  ·  16 days ago

As a minnow myself I totally see this, I don't post often and would love to get those early upvotes, I even tried some of the earlier services but they didn't get you much more than what they cost, so now I refuse to use any of these services and rarely even hit the promote button. I'm in this for the long game so I don't feel the need to earn everything over night.

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59
  ·  15 days ago

Yeap, I agree!

But, as it stands, vote-buying is being heavily abused, not by minnows who try to get good content seen, but by spamposts buying heavy votes for stolen meme's and plagiarized content.

Buying upvotes on post shortly before payout, making correctional downvotes impossible, is the best way to abuse this mechanism "safely". I think that's what @grumpycat is trying to get at, and I can see that making sense.

About the issue I've raised myself here initially, the skewed discovery due to paid-for-votes dominating the trending and hot sections... I wouldn't complain if those were usually quality posts.

Imho. Paid-Votes for ROI and increased visibility, that's fine for posts older than a day and younger than 4.

Oh and... have you looked into the functionality of "promoted"? Initially there was a concept of "buying" visibility that actually benefited the reward pool. Too bad it's so poorly implemented that greedy whales can just sell their votes to greedy spammers nowadays...

It's a complicated issue, and I find it exciting to see the community dealing with it. I am not against vote-selling, it's part of the game and I'll much rather have it done openly than under the counter by some big players. But I also support putting pressure on vote-sellers to do their business in a way that's not harmful to this ecosystem.

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49
  ·  15 days ago

Sadly, when I've tried the "promoted" feature I didn't see nearly the payoff that I get from 1SBD to randowhale or similar.

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47
  ·  8 days ago

I am new so still trying to learn the ropes. I am not keen on the idea of buying upvotes and haven't done so far but it seems that I may have to try that out. Thanks for helping me understand the system.

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41
  ·  17 days ago

@fraenk thanks for the explanation. I came across something like this today and it seems that many people use this. I think if others at much higher levels are using such services then why should I not use it. But I also see that this can potentially reduce quality and reward those who can spend more.

Should it not actually be banned entirely or at least limit the number of such votes each user can buy in a given timeframe? This number can be limited to a fixed upper ceiling for all accounts irrespective of steempower. What do you think?

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59
  ·  17 days ago

Sure, such "safeguards" could be implemented and would help a lot, but here's the catch:

Steem is an open blockchain protocol, it is impossible (well, impractical) to enforce such rules on the blockchain itself. They will have to be implemented by those who run the bots. Only very few operators do so, because of course this would limit their turnover. And that's why projects like @grumpycat try to enforce such rules with "economic" and "social" pressure.

I guess that's how anarcho-capitalism plays out?!

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51
  ·  17 days ago

What would happen if people with a lot of SP start flagging them?

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54
  ·  17 days ago

That's a GREAT idea. The question who would have the mettle and willingness to forego short term gains to do. Most whales probably rationalize "Well so-and-so is running a vote selling service so why shouldn't I?"

I think in terms of ethics this is utterly fallacious reasoning but I doubt most of them really give enough of a shit. I think there has been a decided correlation between my cynicism and awareness of how prevalent bid bots have become. I think that steem has become a stake-based cash grab rather than a community intent on producing quality or adding value to the blockchain.

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51
  ·  17 days ago

Thanks for your input. At the end of the day it's what we make it. Even if the whales cash out and things come crashing down - us little people have to all have to stick with it if we truly believe in the Steemit.com platform.

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41
  ·  16 days ago

@mikeycolon - but our belief in the Steemit platform is based on the success the whales have achieved here. If there are such services made available by the very same people and being used by whales and minnows alike, then I think usage of voting services will increase.

For example, why should I not use it at my level given the obvious short term benefits though the long term consequences are not yet clear.

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41
  ·  17 days ago

I am just starting to understand all of this, I guess :) A lot more to learn

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59
  ·  17 days ago

it's a deep deep rabbit hole ;)

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33
  ·  17 days ago

So in a way, crypto is slowly creeping towards the same vices that it seeks to remove from the economy?

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50
  ·  17 days ago

This is a full fledged economy here with all it's bright and dark sides.

WORD
If we want a uncensored platform all of us have to deal with the dark sides.
Thats the thing in a free internet we want, or not?

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47
  ·  8 days ago

Thanks for the explanation. Also very new here and trying to understand how it all works.

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47
  ·  16 days ago

Thanks for your post!
Please Follow, Upvote & Resteem my post to help us to travel & explore more
https://steemit.com/travel/@jonbee/travel-with-us-ep-01-kushtia-sugar-mills-kushtia-bangladesh-bd-steemian

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59
  ·  16 days ago

WTF... ad spam half way into a serious conversation...

sorry bro... 10% flag

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47
  ·  16 days ago

Why bro you give me flag? what fault?

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59
  ·  16 days ago

it's only a 10% flag, I doubt it's been hurting you much at all...

but if you continue rudely interrupting other people's threads with shameless self-promotion you'll better get used to it.

come-on... this isn't even on a post but on a comment that you probably didn't even read.

pffft

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50
  ·  17 days ago

PLEASE TELL ME YOU DIDN'T UPVOTE THIS POST. GRUMPYCAT IS THE WORST HYPOCRITE. THIS POST HAS BEEN UPVOTED BY SEVERAL BID BOTS PAID FOR BY GRUMPYCAT. LOOK BELOW.

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59
  ·  16 days ago

woah! you don't have to scream!

but yes, I DID upvote this post. I actually found this post because @grumpycat overbought several bidbots for this very post. Doing so they actually pushed the vote ROI into the negatives... I don't think that was by mistake?!

I honestly don't know if they act hypocritically, but what I do think to know is that they try to make an impact on the community ethics and they push a necessary debate about the state of steemonomics. I cannot say whether I agree with their methods but I do understand the motive.

They might line their pockets, but they do have a message, too. Votesellers usually lack the latter and don't do shit to prevent abuse for it might reduce their bottom line.

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54
  ·  15 days ago

Oh, so those with mass account worth, and steem to pay for voting bots, should be the only ones to profit from voting bots?
"Doing so they actually pushed the vote ROI into the negatives," for everybody else. For the one guy that might take some of his hard earned steem, to try and get some exposure for a post he spent a lot of hours on; that's a CRIME!
Whether people like it or not, the steemit system is late stage capitalism at it's finest. It takes money to make money. The top 1% have all the wealth (whales), and some of them can throw their weight around and try to set "rules" on a decentralized system like a dictator trying to stay in power. You have those minnows who wallow in envy, because they aren't willing to risk some of their own finances to help them succeed, and hate to see others succeed before them.
Don't get me wrong, there is abuse, and a lot of spammers might use this abuse, but there is a lot of hypocrisy going on at the same time, in the name of justice.
The Irony; the ones profiting off this "WAR" are the ones creating all the drama around it in the first place, regardless of what side they are on. People are following either side like lemmings, while they are just getting played.

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59
  ·  15 days ago

I must say I agree with your statements here in principle.

Regardless of that I probably evaluate the situation differently. The late-stage-capitalism aspects are "enabled" on the blockchain but that's something that we can't effectively change. Well, as I stated in an earlier comment, it's anarcho-capitalism.

It's a big experiment and the social aspects on the platform are playing out like it should be expected.

I cannot agree with with "aggressive" methods but I do embrace a heated debate about such subjects, even if it takes a lot of controversy to get there.

The unjust accumulation of power on this platform is probably intrinsic with the system, the democratization and social adjustments that shape the "culture" here will be what will turn it into either the distopia of greedy capital or the utopia of abundance...

I'd definitely be careful with the word "crime"... the "laws" here are made by the blockchain, and neither buying votes for shitposts nor flagging campaigns are forbidden.

It's ideologies and moral sentiment clashing.

And I'll reiterate, I personally believe the vote-sellers are the ones who need to step up and "moralize" their business.

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50
  ·  16 days ago

Message would be better received if payouts were declined. Otherwise it looks just as scammy as anything else on here. I used all caps to get attention because this post is overloaded with spam comments: another tasteless irony.

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43
  ·  17 days ago

Thanks for asking exactly what i was thinking.

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51
  ·  17 days ago

Thanks for asking because I was afraid to ask!

🤔

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37
  ·  16 days ago

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54
  ·  17 days ago

I've opted out because I honestly don't believe in them as a matter of principle. Something greasy about my having money to employ vote buying to put my post above someone else who may not when it's not strictly about quality.

It's not just greasy. It's GRE-HE-HE-HEASY!

But I can hear what you're saying about letting the shameless walk away with all of it themselves. It's rather tempting but I cannot go against my own conscience on the matter.

I started a program to hopefully curb the overvalued post issue through incentivized flags but it's still in the process of getting hammered out. Personally, there's enough reason to go after bid botted blockchain diarrhea more than anything else. I dream of a whale setting up an anti-bid bot. I absolutely hate what bid bots have done to this platform.

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59
  ·  16 days ago

I respect that a lot. There's too few people of principle, but really THAT is what should actually matter!

Anyways, I have made my peace with buying votes (though, yes, it does still feel a bit filthy) as it is part of the current economy. And really, if "the shameless" are left to it by themselves, they'll be the ones gaining influence and power to shape this community... and THAT is the real danger here.

I believe there is an ethical way of trading votes, if it is done transparently, without skewing the organic discovery too much and with reasonable caps and quality standards. I hope some bot-operators will see this eventually, they are the ones who can and must use their power responsibly.

We can't really blame minnows trying to make a buck and get seen. But bot operators tolerating hundred dollar upvotes on shitty reposted memes and stolen facebook pictures, that's what needs to stop!

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50
  ·  16 days ago

If you're investing in promotion of your product (your content), it's not some sort of sin. It's not objectively good or bad. I would assume that most people who spend money to promote low-quality products will eventually get weeded out.

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54
  ·  15 days ago

Exactly!
People act like it some sort of sin to PROMOTE YOUR PRODUCT! That's what steemit is! It's you, promoting yourself (the product) with the idea of gaining some $$ for your time.
I hope the people complaining about this NEVER watch TV, as it's full of companies PAYING for ADVERTISING! They are filling a service that you pay for already with spam! But hey, have to watch my shows, and stuff...
It's no different than paid votes on steemit.
I couldn't stand paid adverts on TV, so I canceled it, and got netflix. If you don't like someone posting spam, USE THE HIDE BUTTON FOLKS! and let them waste their money.

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59
  ·  16 days ago

I sure hope so, too... but it wouldn't hurt if voting bot operators tried to have some sort of guidelines and abuse prevention

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54
  ·  17 days ago

I never thought about it this way... "my real supporters get their curation"... I always used the voting bot off the hop just to make sure it was known and fair... I will rethink my approach. Thank you.

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49
  ·  17 days ago

Because the self appointed hall monitors care more about people making more money than them than they do about actual shit content making the site unusable/unviewable.

They'll expend infinite amounts of voting power and time slagging off a handful of people who self vote while ignoring the thousands of spambots. All why saying they're doing it "for the community", when what they mean is "for their own ego".

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25
  ·  17 days ago

Well, I think this problem nearly is unsolvable, because as long it's free to vote posts up there will be people abusing this system by botting their posts.
The only thing we can do is hoping that most of the newbies understand vulnerability of this complex system.

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38
  ·  16 days ago

@fraenk wow a nice i was just thinking about it whats going on is it against thee rules of steem community getting a vote from a bot.so its important for that what i am people know me according to that i dont need an upovte by a bot <3

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51
  ·  16 days ago

Wait.... What... You can get last minute $20 votes??

55
  ·  17 days ago

This explains it well

https://steemit.com/steemit/@pawsdog/please-join-me-in-flagging-a-shit-post-and-reward-pool-abuser

Here is another user (@pradeeprajora) trying it and succeeding, I flagged him and he said he would stop but did it again a few hours ago.. I don't have the HP to stop him but maybe someone here can nut up and go after this..

https://steemit.com/love/@pradeeprajora/brother-s

https://steemit.com/love/@pradeeprajora/107-love-quest $60 for a stolen FB image...

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54
  ·  17 days ago

This issue is becoming a serious conquest, I believe efforts regrading this would be made soonest.
the reward pool keeps being raped.

But at the same time, controversies would always set in.

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55
  ·  15 days ago

True, I agree and I don't think it is so much one user and a number of users taking small bits at a time that add up and hurt the pool.

70
  ·  17 days ago

It looks like you are preparing to do a 6th day self vote on your @checkthisout account to avoid flags from @berniesanders. Would you care to comment on your hypocrisy?

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64
  ·  17 days ago

No

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60
  ·  16 days ago

Why would he? Check his wallet

9 days ago Start power down of 601,481.989 STEEM

2 days ago Transfer 46263.172 STEEM to bittrex

The next power down is scheduled to happen in 5 days.

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60
  ·  16 days ago

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40
  ·  17 days ago

Please upvote the comment please please please

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50
  ·  17 days ago

LOOK AT THIS SHIT! @GRUMPYCAT LIKES TO UPVOTE HIS OWN COMMENTS TOO! WHAT A SHITHEAD. WHY ARE YOU UPVOTING THIS CAT CRAP. GRUMPYCAT HAS PAID FOR BID BOTS ON THIS VERY POST.

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40
  ·  16 days ago

Hey @artopium — props on not beating around the bush and calling out the hypocrisy of pussy-cat, bringing to light the silly irony in this whole thing.animated.gif

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37
  ·  16 days ago

Umm? I think you missed the point. The cat is down-voting posts that use the bots after they are 3.5 days old. This post is not.

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50
  ·  16 days ago

what's the point in that? You know, it's not hard to see the glaring hypocrisy here. Just oppen your eyes. Is grumpycat here to help or here to make over $1000 SBD on this post? Seeing that grumpycat is a whale that can grant $200 upvotes, and that grumpycat is upvoting his (her?) own comments, ON THIS VERY POST, AND buying bid bots, it's really hard to see grumpycat as a moral beacon. But good luck with that.

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50
  ·  16 days ago

I don't understand why the value of our content has to expire after seven days in the first place. You can post evergreen content on your website and enjoy the value of it for years. I guess there's a reason for this, but I haven't wrapped my head around it.

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60
  ·  16 days ago

It's entirely a technical limitation. A good way of thinking of it is the difference between your computers memory and hard drive. Basically, as the reward pool/consensus mechanism is making its calculations for reward distribution, all eligible posts (under 7 days) are essentially held in memory. After that they can go into more of a "blockchain storage" type setup like your hard drive. In order to payout posts in perpetuity, everything would have to remain in active memory which makes it basically impossible to run a Steem node server due to the extreme and perhaps impossible technical specs that system would need.
I do think we'll eventually see systems or workarounds that allow good quality content to be evergreen or rediscovered and achieve new payouts. But like most social media, the vast majority of content (selfies and pics of people dinner) doesn't need to be hogging RAM on a server in the hopes it might get an upvote a few years after it's posted.

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60
  ·  16 days ago

I'm sure that was not the most expensive "No" in history, but definitely in the running

59
  ·  11 days ago

Hey @grumpycat stupid cat. You downvote one of my Post because they were "trash" and I used Voting Bots, since when are voting bots agaisnt steemit rules?, Are you downvoting every single Posts that use Voting Bots all just a few? Based on what are you downvoting Posts and what do I have to do to avoid being downvote by you in the future as I dont want to see your stupid comment in my future Posts. Thank you trash!

55
  ·  11 days ago

hahahah i never tought to see grumpy cat here on Steemit. And of course grumpy eat some whales on the way here and he is not satisfied yet XD

53
  ·  17 days ago

People are just sadistic!
They enjoy abusing the reward pool💰

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42
  ·  16 days ago

Gotta make that 💰

64
  ·  17 days ago

It is interesting that almost all of the name are Indian names my wife checked it for me and she is Hindu. I don't want to sound racist but it is what it is.
Great job @grumpycat

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57
  ·  17 days ago

Maybe as Indians are discovering this platform slowly, these are teething troubles.

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47
  ·  16 days ago

Very likely. This site isn't rocket science, but as you use it and come into contact with its intricacies, you don't immediately know what the community deems acceptable. Obviously adding "due dates" to the bid bot tracker is helpful, but based on the nature of the site, there are no stickies or info packets that newbies can read to avoid running into this stuff.

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51
  ·  17 days ago

Those several accounts could be from one or two persons, a group. Their way of working is pretty similar.

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64
  ·  17 days ago

Maybe but we don't know.

60
  ·  16 days ago

My position has always been very unpopular:
figure out a way to eliminate the use of bots on Steemit.

55
  ·  16 days ago

Seriously though, does this post deserve $1000.64 ?

53
  ·  17 days ago

Man this site is so complex. I really wish things were more straightforward. I have never understood how to use the bots really, so I have never gotten into them. I really wish in some ways that the devs would just ban bots altogether, though I know my opinion is not a popular one, as many people have sunk a large investment into them. If Steemit is really to be this organic place with great original content, I don't really see a necessity or place for the bots. Thanks for drawing attention to the last minute upvotes though! That is such a dick move for people to do. Keep on keeping on!

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64
  ·  17 days ago

It's a necessary evil...If you don't have bots how do you get whales to vote on your posts? It's how things have evolved on this decentralized platform. To get an upvote from large accounts you have to be noticed. You can't really get noticed because all the big accounts are self-voting or exchanging each other's votes to swarm the trending pages. There's a lot of good content not being discovered because of this - bots at least give you the chance to crack the top 20 on trending pages.

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53
  ·  17 days ago

I have been moving up slowly but surely without bots just by putting out good content on d.tube. I follow this other guy who is on a quest to make 1 million on the platform by not using bots, and after just a month he has already hit 5k. I think it's possible, it's just a slower way there, that's all. Like I said, it's not a popular opinion.

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64
  ·  17 days ago

It's a catch-22. Crappy content creators get up on the trending pages by buying upvotes or upvoting themselves with their huge SP. Quality content creators have to do the same to keep up. I know anything is possible on this platform, I don't don't doubt that a plankton can get up to whale status. I'm not opposed to getting rid of upvote bots but they'll have to get rid of whale circle jerks and self-voting altogether - Impossible to do.

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53
  ·  17 days ago

That's true. The great whale circle-jerk, and self voting is a huge problem, and the users called out in the article who upvote at the last second. I don't really know what the answers are, so I just keep trucking slowly along haha. Maybe one day things will iron themselves out?

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54
  ·  16 days ago

I'm right there with you. These things have got to go. The problem is they have created a Ponzi economy. We need a hero whale that can start disrupting their operations and hopefully, one day, render this vote buying business obsolete.

I'm following you now. People like us need to stick together. I wanted to share one of my projects. Here's the link and meme that may pique your interest.

https://steemit.com/selfvoting/@trump3t/trump3t-the-no-self-voter-promoter-update-hot-edition

Yes, it does offer a vote service but ONLY to no-self voters and the cost is very minimal and will never be powered down as long as self-voting is a thing. (Hopefully, Trump3t will be able to retire one day.) It's not bid based. 0.01 SBD gets you a full weight vote, feature and resteem. I manually screen each and every post. It's intended to help to grow to curate non-self posts and effect change on Steem.

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53
  ·  16 days ago

Alright. SBD sent. You've convinced me, I'm going to give it a shot!

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42
  ·  17 days ago

How is self voting even allowed, even identifying an account linked to another by some means "multi accounts" should get reduced power when operating closer to an origin account. Instance if an account votes on the same accounts post = 0 , if an account has been voting on every post or comment on another account = 0 . And you can build a whole radius scale based on interaction like that. A lot more complex than what I propose but viable in my opinion.

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54
  ·  16 days ago

I agree. There is a lot of voting circle jerks but I will admit that I typically upvote posts for project account I manage intended to serve the Steem community at large. I'm not sure if maybe I should recuse my self from that in the future but I think it's OK on accounts that I do not receive a profit.

I have personally opted out of self-voting and all bid bots.

I do think people should try to diversify their votes. It helps build a better and more connected community.

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42
  ·  15 days ago

Problem is that relies on people choosing the moral high ground so to speak. This is a thing for proper automation in my opinion.

Punish everyone equally not reward everyone liberally.

Would have to refine that phrase but pretty sure I just thought of it so BOOM.

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44
  ·  17 days ago

Hi @bethwheatcraft . We ( @advertise ) started doing a crowdfunding BitBot campaigns were people group their links into one post and we shoot it to the top of Trending ( well that is the plan) . The thinking is to cleanup some of the mess out there and have one place where people can go to see. We are running a Free campaign now.

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54
  ·  17 days ago

This is a great initiative. Never thought such a step could be taken before.

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44
  ·  14 days ago

Thanks @ufxpression here is the final product . We are tweaking a few things before we start taking payments to crowdfund to the top.

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50
  ·  17 days ago

I DON'T SEE WHY ANYONE IS TAKING THIS POST SERIOUSLY. @GRUMPYCAT HAS BOUGHT VOTES FROM BID BOTS TO UPVOTE THIS VERY POST. GO LOOK BELOW.

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64
  ·  16 days ago

This isn't about buying upvotes. It's about buying upvotes after 6 days has elapsed.

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50
  ·  16 days ago

Why would that matter? Doesn't it bother you that grumpy cat has probably made more on this single post than any of those spammers? Is grumpycat the central authority figure you want to "handle this issue"? So you're fine with grumpycat upvoting his own comments on this post to the tune of over $200 SBD? Do you feel this $1000 SBD post is of $1000 quality content? did grumpycat write a dissertation and I missed it? am I supposed to believe grumpycat is a moral beacon, here to serve justice? It looks A WHOLE more like grumpycat is here for the money, just like those spammers he purports to be eliminating. This is the worst kind of spam, because it looks legit. But this is just a trash blog, filled with hate, and it's earned more in several days than most Steemian dream to make in a year. Very shameful. If grumpycat wants to convince people he's doing the right thing, why not decline payouts? That seems much more noble.

57
  ·  17 days ago

hehe, that is so steem.

58
  ·  16 days ago

I m not sure, you will even read this or not, but still wanted to tell : You are working against spammers, which is fine, but would it not be nice to also reward people who deserve it, by using certain percentage of your vote ? Say you use 60 percent in flagging and 40 percent to encourage ?

I run a charity bot named @thehumanbot with this initiative, encourage people to write original, if you want to join the hands.

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60
  ·  16 days ago

I have read about @thehumanbot and I must say that platform is great sir. :)

66
  ·  13 days ago

Most of the late bidders are shit, not all of them, but certainly, the ones that skirt the 6 days 12-hour threshold are primarily posting low effort content or spam.

61
  ·  17 days ago

Congratulations @grumpycat, this post is the most rewarded post (based on pending payouts) in the last 12 hours written by a Superhero or Legend account holder (accounts hold greater than 100 Mega Vests). The total number of posts by Superhero and Legend account holders during this period was 39 and the total pending payments to posts in these categories was $7942.01. To see the full list of highest paid posts across all accounts categories, click here.

If you do not wish to receive these messages in future, please reply stop to this comment.

55
  ·  16 days ago

I mean, there are a million users out there who created extremely good content but there's just no one to witness it and being dumped to trash for their hard work. It's definitely heartache to see that, all I hope that is steemit is coming out a system to help good article producers to go further rather than just getting a few penny going for their crazy hard work :(

47
  ·  17 days ago

I'm of the mind that in a perfect world there would be no paid upvotes. But if we can't reach a consensus on that, maybe the community can agree to some rules. Cap the amount of money these pay for play services can dish out? If we war game this out, its easy to see how upvote bots would spread like cancer. First, the bad actors use the upvote bots, then quality content creators use them just to keep up. I would suggest the witnesses come up with a "certification process" (with a certification logo and all). Bots that cap a paid upvote at say $10.00 (or whatever concensus number) and have some mechamism to seek out quality content are "certified" by the witnesses (with a certification logo so we know). And bots that are upvoting insane amounts of money and have quality curation methodology are flagged and hopefully destroyed. But then again, it would probably be really difficult to reach a consensus on rules. But I'm just trying to throw out ideas to reach a conclusion. I see Steemit as the future for webcomics and the health of Steemit is my top priority so I'm just trying to get a dialogue going on this.

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64
  ·  17 days ago

I like this idea. How to implement...probably impossible. "Quality" is subjective just like art.

37
  ·  17 days ago

good post

50
  ·  17 days ago

20 Bucks vote?!
How is it possible to step in this list?
I`m not a english native speaker, but 20$ votes are international - so come on Dudes - i live in also called "3rd world country" and your votes here on my postings are more worth, then anywhere else in the world.

Whenever i think: "Yeah - i got it"
Another guy comes around like this :

So sad for a little plankton in the big Steemit ocean :(

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45
  ·  17 days ago

If plankton sticks together though... 💪😁🤗

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49
  ·  17 days ago

It means little. Sadly.

Many of the big fish make sure of it by never using their vp for going out and rewarding small content providers unless they invest. Instead they use it to bash the people who do invest in cases where they start making more money than them.

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45
  ·  17 days ago

Everybody starts of as plankton, not? If you don't believe, you will never grow, if you don't have faith, you will never get anywhere in the sea of life, appreciate the small things in life, and big things might just happen, anyhow, I hear it's lonely at the top, so I'm enjoying my time feeding at the bottom with the rest of you 😁

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49
  ·  17 days ago

Not everyone starts as plankton. Wales dump a bunch of money into steem to try to get more vote power to make more money for themselves.

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50
  ·  17 days ago

I hear it's lonely at the top, so I'm enjoying my time feeding at the bottom with the rest of you 😁

Yeah thats the way @cryptocatz

Wales dump a bunch of money into steem to try to get more vote power to make more money for themselves.

True & sad, @secondstar - with money everything goes better and faster forward - but anyway - if plankton build a swarm und swarm around it is ok :D

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50
  ·  17 days ago

WORD - so i will send over my favorit assistent to watch out you blog ;)

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45
  ·  17 days ago

😁 thanks, I mean it though, what's 1 whale in an ocean full of plankton, right ? We will allways be a majority, whatever happens, stick together like birds of a feather 🤗

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54
  ·  17 days ago

Absolutely.

49
  ·  17 days ago

may i

55
  ·  17 days ago

You got a 36.43% upvote from @postpromoter courtesy of @checkthisout!

59
  ·  11 days ago

Here @GrumpyCat just made this Posts about you: https://steemit.com/steemit/@dineroconopcion/is-grumpycat-abusing-it-s-steempower

Hope you like it as it's not trash unlike your content! :)

42
  ·  17 days ago

ehhh how to get it lol

73
  ·  17 days ago
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50
  ·  16 days ago

You're welcome @jerrybanfield.

41
  ·  17 days ago

I congratulate people who gain from this can you analyse to me how this is possible.

52
  ·  17 days ago

So that is what is happening? I'm constantly seeing this one guy posting stuff that has taking a minute to write, and it immediately gets a 20 dollar upvote by someone. The post is just a simple picture, with a short description. And it's the same person who upvotes it to above 20 dollar every single time. Do you think he has bought the vote?

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39
  ·  17 days ago

That chinese guy? I saw many of those accounts. Spamming a picture with some text and getting 20-30 in votes. Maybe they do some vote buying?

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52
  ·  17 days ago

It's titled something like "mans dream" yeah

31
  ·  17 days ago

When you let money play, money wins.

A direct money transfer is an unmediated transaction of money and upvotes.

Normally the transaction is mediated by content, as follows:
User/creator effort + money investment = content, which => upvotes

Unmediated:
User effort + money => upvotes

This is caused by the fact that the overall quality and volume of content here on Steemit is low enough that it allows small players to disrupt proper curation and quality-filtering by purchasing upvotes.
This would never happen on Youtube for example because any reasonable amount of money spent on buying views would not put you at the top of the trending charts (because competition and overall quality & volume of content is too high).

tl;dr
If steemIT grows enough, buying upvotes will go away by itself.

51
  ·  17 days ago

I do not really agree with you. We do you use the bots because we have not yet reached your level. If I tell you to take a look at my post, will you? I doubt. Moreover, if I tell you to invite my post, will you? I doubt. It's not that you can't buy because it's hard to see my post since I have little steemit power.
I think you guys should support us as we try to develop ourselves . We do also want to grow and share our views all over the world. But how will I do it if I don't have someone to help me through?
OK. I know you are laughing at me.
I did joined steemit 3 weeks back and I have been posting stuffs but could not reach far but when I started buying bots and I think I have got something out of it.

We do love steemit and we will be happy if you whales provides more appropriate ways to spread our post all over the world. I am not afraid to but upvotes and may be you can explain me more or post something about buying bots I will be happy.

Just my opinion.

Thanks

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50
  ·  17 days ago

DUDE, @GRUMPYCAT BOUGHT VOTES FROM A BID BOT. LOOK BELOW. THIS WHOLE POST IS CAT CRAP.

39
  ·  17 days ago

Can anyone please explain the bonus link at the bottom of the article? Why are there so many spam comments that bring like 10$?! Do they have bots that upvote them?

61
  ·  17 days ago

That was fast... now the spammers are upvoting on the 3rd day instead lol.

57
  ·  17 days ago

This post has received a 24.92 % upvote from @booster thanks to: @checkthisout.

34
  ·  17 days ago

Awesome post!

8
  ·  17 days ago

Great Post. AirNet Hawk-Project - @exstyle = 06/01/2018 _AHP4 :
Sample of "nothing at stake" peoples, empowered on 6th day by voting bots!
https://steemit.com/@exstyle

57
  ·  17 days ago

that last one? like wtf. at this point we need to get rid of upvoting comments, or upvoting only first day, or something. this kind of shit needs to stop.

32
  ·  17 days ago

But I also see that this can potentially reduce quality and reward those who can spend more. Indian names my wife checked it for me and she is Hindu. I don't want to sound racist but it is what it is.

My bigger problem is the amount of spam on the platform. Just read a few comments down and you will see what i have in mind.
@grumpycat

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70
  ·  17 days ago

Grumpycat doesn't care about spam. He is one of Steem's biggest spammers. He only cares about making sure he makes the most.

25
  ·  17 days ago

Well I have to say people made bots and mostly they are use for their advantage not the fairness of things.

48
  ·  17 days ago

You got a 7.06% upvote from @upme requested by: @grumpycat.
Send at least 1.5 SBD to @upme with a post link in the memo field to receive upvote next round.
To support our activity, please vote for my master @suggeelson, as a STEEM Witness

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25
  ·  17 days ago

thanks!

25
  ·  17 days ago

Add mee toooo

29
  ·  17 days ago

Wow, teach me the ropes to this blogging style. You are making a killing haha. Congratz!! @itsteems

50
  ·  17 days ago

very nice post
greetings

35
  ·  17 days ago

How lovely

41
  ·  17 days ago

Great post happy to be your follower and the post you made is great keep supporing us thanks @grumpycat

32
  ·  17 days ago

I'm still not sure how this all works I do know though I would not mind finding out how to people actually to get to see my posts? As soon as You post something it disappears down the line.

31
  ·  17 days ago

very nice soon i will join this club
best wishes for all

43
  ·  17 days ago

I see your point.
As a noob I'm still not 100% aware of how the system is working.
For me 20$ overall (on like 10 posts) would be great :D

39
  ·  17 days ago

😂😂😂 fun

44
  ·  17 days ago

Great post. Your content is very interesting, the animated video of cart clapping hand is awesome. Keep it up. I follow and upvote you.

43
  ·  17 days ago
45
  ·  17 days ago

hahhaha that is a funny one!!! you got my vote !

26
  ·  17 days ago

my God, what a gorgeous photo. thanks for the great post. very impressed.Can someone explain me in detail what it is this all about.I am also interested to take part in it.And how is it possible to step in this list.

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64
  ·  16 days ago

Do you just copy and paste this generic response on every trending post you see?

37
  ·  17 days ago

I apologize if this has already been asked somewhere but couldn't some sort of captcha for comments eliminate most bot activity?

41
  ·  17 days ago

hello friend I follow you excellent publication, I invite you to go through my blog maybe something you like

41
  ·  17 days ago

I found out one more here @grumpycat

https://steemit.com/@foodpanda

25
  ·  17 days ago

Hummminnnaahhhh

36
  ·  17 days ago

I'd like a $20 upvote! 🤑

31
  ·  17 days ago

hahahaha

40
  ·  17 days ago

I seriously dont understand what is happening? Really confused

54
  ·  17 days ago

I've never gotten a $20 upvote, I wonder what it feels like?

52
  ·  17 days ago

Wow, if you have done it, .. success always for you friend

32
  ·  17 days ago

However, this algorithm has one important flaw: there is "nothing at stake". In the event of a fork, whether the fork is accidental or a malicious attempt to rewrite history and reverse a transaction, the optimal strategy for any miner is to mine on every chain, so that the miner gets their reward no matter which fork wins. Thus, assuming a large number of economically interested miners, an attacker may be able to send a transaction in exchange for some digital good (usually another cryptocurrency), receive the good, then start a fork of the blockchain from one block behind the transaction and send the money to themselves instead, and even with 1% of the total stake the attacker's fork would win because everyone else is mining on both.

33
  ·  17 days ago

Please follow me

37
  ·  17 days ago

Nothing at stake, I don't seem to get the concept. Could you please enlighten me? Thanks!

25
  ·  17 days ago

Great stuff

39
  ·  17 days ago

Thank you for sharing

25
  ·  17 days ago

This post very nice

33
  ·  17 days ago

Hola bienvenido a esta maravillosa comunidad espero sea de mucho éxitos para ti y puedas aprender cosas nuevas te saluda tu amigo @yoelvis11

37
  ·  17 days ago

Nice post !!

25
  ·  17 days ago

nice

40
  ·  17 days ago

Please upvote the comment please please please

26
  ·  17 days ago

I do not understand anything about this publication ... What is the purpose? I'm new to this

53
  ·  17 days ago

Oh, I like this, the first 6 votes are bots, so when is it ok to use bots?

In your humble opinion (IYHO) oh Grumpy One?

I think there need to be clear guidelines because this isn't going away anytime soon.

Your 'Don't upvote past 3.5 days threat' is a decent start but then you upvote a commenter that admits to upvoting on days 3-5. What gives?

Did I miss the 'sarcasm' wink in your post?

But seriously, what is best for the community here?

I'm thinking of upvoting in the first few hours to get a little attention, and then to complete the balance of upvotes on day 3 to ensure my followers get a decent return could be a decent strategy.

What do you think?

Is there some consensus we can all come to?

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50
  ·  16 days ago

Steemit is governed by the laws of chaos, which is good. The bad thing is, just like the real world money still is the supreme law.

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  ·  17 days ago
44
  ·  17 days ago

Lol love the clapping cat.

55
  ·  17 days ago

This post has received gratitude of 5.08 % from @appreciator thanks to: @grumpycat.

25
  ·  17 days ago

LOL love this

25
  ·  17 days ago

Pls I need ur vote pls need some money to pay my tuition fee help a guy in need

39
  ·  17 days ago

nice post

60
  ·  17 days ago

can see this happening a lot and thanks for bringing it up. any solution to this issue from your end?

25
  ·  11 days ago

its a shame people abuse a platform like this. isnt it great enough?

38
  ·  17 days ago

Wait..

-What are you talm' 'bout my dude.
Can someone exlpain to this simpleton plz?

@darienparlick

43
  ·  16 days ago

What is happening, i really don't get and yes am new!

49
  ·  16 days ago

Well bonus link just ripped my eyes out !!

43
  ·  17 days ago

This post very nice..Thanks for sharing sharing this post...Best of luck..

32
  ·  16 days ago

I have been checking most of the comments to understand what this post is all about ..

25
  ·  17 days ago

can u tell me the thruth behined it ..........how they are getting

60
  ·  16 days ago

Well, I know few more people who are like that. You might check some people coming from our country. :) Oops

56
  ·  16 days ago

asshole streetshitters